Discussion:
"ALO PRESIDENTE" presents Chavez vs. Venezuela
(demasiado antiguo para responder)
JFK
2003-12-08 00:19:42 UTC
Permalink
Chavez refuses to accept poll bid
Sun 7 December, 2003 20:01

By Pascal Fletcher

CARACAS, Venezuela (Reuters) - Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez has
warned electoral authorities he will not accept a referendum on his
rule if they approve what he says are fraudulent opposition signatures
seeking such a vote.

Speaking during his weekly television and radio broadcast "Hello
President", Chavez demanded that he be allowed to personally count the
signatures "one by one".

It was the leftist president's bluntest warning that he would seek to
block efforts to secure a constitutional referendum on his rule.

The opposition says it has gathered enough signatures to trigger a
vote but Chavez insists the petition is riddled with false signatures.

Referring to Venezuela's National Electoral Council as "the referee,"
Chavez said: "If the referee comes along and, let's say, recognises
these signatures, then we can't play can we?".

"In that unlikely case, there couldn't be any electoral process in
Venezuela and of course this government wouldn't recognise it at all."

Opposition leaders have voiced fears that Chavez may try to avoid a
referendum, either through legal challenges or manoeuvres, or
ultimately, through force. But they hope international pressure will
stop this happening.

Chavez, who led several thousand supporters Saturday in a rally to
celebrate five years in power, repeated a charge that the 3.6 million
pro-referendum signatures, which his foes say they collected a week
ago, were a "mega-fraud."

His opponents, who say Chavez has opened political and social wounds
that are tearing the nation apart, will formally deliver the
pro-referendum signatures next week.

BARRAGE OF ACCUSATIONS

Brandishing what he said were lists of thousands of fraudulent
signatures, Chavez repeated accusations that the petition had been
packed with he names of foreigners, under-age minors and dead people.
He also said many people had illegally signed more than once.

Government leaders say the opposition only collected 1.9 million
signatures, well short of the 2.4 million required to trigger a vote.

The accusations place heavy pressure on the National Electoral
Council, which must decide in early January whether or not to hold a
referendum in April or May.

Chavez demanded that electoral authorities provide him with a
certified list of the identities on the pro-referendum petition.
"We're going to check them one by one," he said.

He denied he was trying to intimidate the electoral authorities,
saying: "You have my respect and support."

But his remarks were likely to trigger alarm in international bodies
like the Organisation of American States and the Atlanta-based Carter
Centre, which are monitoring Venezuela's referendum process.

OAS chief Cesar Gaviria has said his observers saw no sign of
widespread cheating in the November 28-December 1 pro-referendum
signature drive, a comment which earned him a rebuke from Chavez who
accused him of siding with his foes.

The OAS, the Carter Centre, and the United States, the biggest buyer
of Venezuela's oil, have all said they have faith in the electoral
council and have urged the government and the opposition to accept its
final decision.
pedro martori
2003-12-08 01:35:53 UTC
Permalink
SE VE DESDE YA QUE ESTE ENERGUMENO CHAVEZ, NO QUIERE ACEPTA EL VEREDICTO DLE
PUEBLO SOBERANO Y UNICO QUE PUEDE DECIDIR SI SE QUEDA O NO SE QUEDA EN EL
GOBIENRO.


SI ESTA TAN SEGURO DE QUE HUBO TRAMPAS, QUE DEJE DE ACUSAR SIN PRUEBAS...
Y SI HACE FALTA COMPROBAR TODOS CALUMNIOSOS ATAQUES A LA OPOSICION, QUE
VENGAN A VNEZUELA JUECES IMPARCIALES, AJENOS AL PROCESO Y Y SIN
IMPLICACIONES O PARTIDARISMO HACIA NINGUNO DE LOS DOS BANDOS.

SOLO UNA TERCERA POSICION IMPARCIAL Y SIN INTERESES QUE COMPROMETAN DICHA
IMPARCIALIDAD, PUEDEN VERIFICAR SIN LA MENOR DE LAS DUDAS QUIENES GANARON
ESE REVOCATORIO.
Y SI AUN NO ESTA CONVENCIDO QUE LE 85 % DE LA POBLACION FIRMO CONTRA SU
MANDATO...QUE HAGA OTRO REVOCATORIO CON JUECES, OBSERVADORES Y ORGAISMOS
INTERNACIONALES TOTALMENTE IMPARCIALIZADOS.

QUE LOS OBSERVAORES VEAN EN LAS CALLES A MILLONES DE CIUDADANOS, Y QUE LOS
VIDEOS TOMADOS SEAN LA PRUEBA FINAL CONTRA ESTE TRAMPOSO Y TRAIDOR CON
INFULAS DE DICTADOR..
Post by JFK
Chavez refuses to accept poll bid
Sun 7 December, 2003 20:01
By Pascal Fletcher
CARACAS, Venezuela (Reuters) - Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez has
warned electoral authorities he will not accept a referendum on his
rule if they approve what he says are fraudulent opposition signatures
seeking such a vote.
Speaking during his weekly television and radio broadcast "Hello
President", Chavez demanded that he be allowed to personally count the
signatures "one by one".
It was the leftist president's bluntest warning that he would seek to
block efforts to secure a constitutional referendum on his rule.
The opposition says it has gathered enough signatures to trigger a
vote but Chavez insists the petition is riddled with false signatures.
Referring to Venezuela's National Electoral Council as "the referee,"
Chavez said: "If the referee comes along and, let's say, recognises
these signatures, then we can't play can we?".
"In that unlikely case, there couldn't be any electoral process in
Venezuela and of course this government wouldn't recognise it at all."
Opposition leaders have voiced fears that Chavez may try to avoid a
referendum, either through legal challenges or manoeuvres, or
ultimately, through force. But they hope international pressure will
stop this happening.
Chavez, who led several thousand supporters Saturday in a rally to
celebrate five years in power, repeated a charge that the 3.6 million
pro-referendum signatures, which his foes say they collected a week
ago, were a "mega-fraud."
His opponents, who say Chavez has opened political and social wounds
that are tearing the nation apart, will formally deliver the
pro-referendum signatures next week.
BARRAGE OF ACCUSATIONS
Brandishing what he said were lists of thousands of fraudulent
signatures, Chavez repeated accusations that the petition had been
packed with he names of foreigners, under-age minors and dead people.
He also said many people had illegally signed more than once.
Government leaders say the opposition only collected 1.9 million
signatures, well short of the 2.4 million required to trigger a vote.
The accusations place heavy pressure on the National Electoral
Council, which must decide in early January whether or not to hold a
referendum in April or May.
Chavez demanded that electoral authorities provide him with a
certified list of the identities on the pro-referendum petition.
"We're going to check them one by one," he said.
He denied he was trying to intimidate the electoral authorities,
saying: "You have my respect and support."
But his remarks were likely to trigger alarm in international bodies
like the Organisation of American States and the Atlanta-based Carter
Centre, which are monitoring Venezuela's referendum process.
OAS chief Cesar Gaviria has said his observers saw no sign of
widespread cheating in the November 28-December 1 pro-referendum
signature drive, a comment which earned him a rebuke from Chavez who
accused him of siding with his foes.
The OAS, the Carter Centre, and the United States, the biggest buyer
of Venezuela's oil, have all said they have faith in the electoral
council and have urged the government and the opposition to accept its
final decision.
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ahlahan
2003-12-08 04:00:52 UTC
Permalink
"Speaking during his weekly television and radio broadcast "Hello
President", Chavez demanded that he be allowed to personally count the
signatures "one by one".
"

Hmmmm ... that will keep him busy for 6 o 7 years. Is this Chavez the
biggest idiot in Latin America ?
What is this assholes education ?
Post by JFK
Chavez refuses to accept poll bid
Sun 7 December, 2003 20:01
By Pascal Fletcher
CARACAS, Venezuela (Reuters) - Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez has
warned electoral authorities he will not accept a referendum on his
rule if they approve what he says are fraudulent opposition signatures
seeking such a vote.
Speaking during his weekly television and radio broadcast "Hello
President", Chavez demanded that he be allowed to personally count the
signatures "one by one".
It was the leftist president's bluntest warning that he would seek to
block efforts to secure a constitutional referendum on his rule.
The opposition says it has gathered enough signatures to trigger a
vote but Chavez insists the petition is riddled with false signatures.
Referring to Venezuela's National Electoral Council as "the referee,"
Chavez said: "If the referee comes along and, let's say, recognises
these signatures, then we can't play can we?".
"In that unlikely case, there couldn't be any electoral process in
Venezuela and of course this government wouldn't recognise it at all."
Opposition leaders have voiced fears that Chavez may try to avoid a
referendum, either through legal challenges or manoeuvres, or
ultimately, through force. But they hope international pressure will
stop this happening.
Chavez, who led several thousand supporters Saturday in a rally to
celebrate five years in power, repeated a charge that the 3.6 million
pro-referendum signatures, which his foes say they collected a week
ago, were a "mega-fraud."
His opponents, who say Chavez has opened political and social wounds
that are tearing the nation apart, will formally deliver the
pro-referendum signatures next week.
BARRAGE OF ACCUSATIONS
Brandishing what he said were lists of thousands of fraudulent
signatures, Chavez repeated accusations that the petition had been
packed with he names of foreigners, under-age minors and dead people.
He also said many people had illegally signed more than once.
Government leaders say the opposition only collected 1.9 million
signatures, well short of the 2.4 million required to trigger a vote.
The accusations place heavy pressure on the National Electoral
Council, which must decide in early January whether or not to hold a
referendum in April or May.
Chavez demanded that electoral authorities provide him with a
certified list of the identities on the pro-referendum petition.
"We're going to check them one by one," he said.
He denied he was trying to intimidate the electoral authorities,
saying: "You have my respect and support."
But his remarks were likely to trigger alarm in international bodies
like the Organisation of American States and the Atlanta-based Carter
Centre, which are monitoring Venezuela's referendum process.
OAS chief Cesar Gaviria has said his observers saw no sign of
widespread cheating in the November 28-December 1 pro-referendum
signature drive, a comment which earned him a rebuke from Chavez who
accused him of siding with his foes.
The OAS, the Carter Centre, and the United States, the biggest buyer
of Venezuela's oil, have all said they have faith in the electoral
council and have urged the government and the opposition to accept its
final decision.
JFK
2003-12-08 16:35:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by ahlahan
"Speaking during his weekly television and radio broadcast "Hello
President", Chavez demanded that he be allowed to personally count the
signatures "one by one".
"
Hmmmm ... that will keep him busy for 6 o 7 years. Is this Chavez the
biggest idiot in Latin America ?
What is this assholes education ?
In the politics of this third world nation one calls it the
"survival-of-the-least-fit"......
Enjoy this article below.

Jonathan -

[EL UNIVERSAL] - Over the last four years, Venezuelan society has been
ravished by a no-holds-barred political crisis. With efforts to recall
President Hugo Chavez entering their critical weeks, Venezuela is
poised to go into a transition fraught with risks and challenges.
Events upon us will define the extent to which the holder of the
largest energy reserves in the Americas can avert civil conflict and
resolve its problems democratically.

Venezuela's problems did not begin yesterday. Prior to today's
polarization, Venezuela had undergone two decades of decline in every
possible quality-of-life measure. Since 1958, and for exactly four
decades, a set of implicit and explicit pacts amongst the nation's
elites brought about what seemed to be political stability. But,
greased with copious income from oil exports, these deals only served
to stifle competition in the economy and enshrined neglect and
impunity in and out of government.

Nowhere is the "survival-of-the-least-fit" incongruity more evident
and destructive than in the political arena. President Hugo Chavez,
elected by a hapless blend of uninspired competition and voter
despondency, has failed to internalize that he is not so much the
redeemer but the embodiment of an immense evolutionary tragedy. If a
"modern" society opts for someone so clearly unhinged, one can only
infer that umpteen billions of dollars were wasted over decades
building what has turned into a Caribbean drenched version of the
village at Potemkin.

The ongoing political crisis represents a radical reversal of fortune
for Hugo Chávez whose popularity has dwindled from 80 to 35 percent
according to most polls. For the opposition movement, as heterogeneous
as the country itself, it seems the President's unraveling came about
too rapidly. Its molten political infrastructure and discredited
leadership have been incapable of morphing its abundant oomph into a
desirable or viable governing alternative. If Chávez still commands
support, it is because you cannot fill a real gap with a virtual void.

To understand Venezuela, you must appreciate that unchecked access to
billions of dollars derived from the state controlled oil industry has
granted Mr. Chávez the "right" to ignore the demands of the majority
that was once his. Other leaders have not enjoyed this luxury and are
forced to either negotiate or leave office when confronted with a
significant and sustained challenge from a dejected population or
parliament.

The key challenge for Venezuela today is not only to survive the
wanton destruction brought about by revolutionary involution, but also
to pull itself out of a fatal tailspin with new leadership that
reestablishes legitimacy and governability. Only thus, can we face the
epic challenge of addressing the disgraceful poverty that has come to
describe and indict our country. This stabilization process is easier
described than executed given the bizarre leadership struggle under
way among those who seek to recall or topple Mr. Chávez.

If the opposition is able to defend the signatures obtained this past
weekend, and then garner enough votes, ninety days hence, to recall
the now unpopular president, they must then field one or more
candidates that are able to offer choices, capture the imagination and
buy much needed time from an impatient electorate. Traditional
politicians and their conspicuous private sector corrupters will have
to listen to a population begging them to quit maneuvering and give
others, probably less experienced, but perhaps more virtuous, a chance
to present their case and lead. Uncontaminated leadership will be
required because putting the Venezuelan Humpty Dumpty back together
will involve drawing on the best to deal with: reconciliation among
its citizens; reconstruction of a gravely defective Judicial system;
re-institutionalization of the fragmented and politicized Armed
Forces; redefinition of production strategy and corporate governance
in the vital oil sector; modernization of the civil service;
decentralization as a means to share responsibility with the states
over the delivery of services and execution of public works; mending
of traditional international relationships and alliances: and eviction
of all foreign armed elements. And, all these tasks after, or
simultaneous, with the promethean task of resuscitating a moribund
economy.

If on the other hand, by hook or by crook, Mr. Chávez is able to fight
off the recall drive at either the petition or voting stage, he too
will have to come up with a way to transition from his current style
of governance to one more democratic and effective. Of course, there
is a risk that Mr. Chávez might assume his unlikely victory as a
mandate to corner and liquidate his opponents. If this were the case,
the transition of power will inexorably occur through more concerted
civil disobedience that has unceremoniously brought down other self
appointed saviors and spent tyrants in the recent past such as Alberto
Fujimori, Slobodan Milosevic, Joseph Estrada and, most recently,
Edward Shevardnadze.

We are on the verge of a complex transition in Venezuela. The
international community must be ready to resolutely ensure that the
threat of violence is defused under all transition scenarios. The
United States has much at stake and cannot afford to err when dealing
with one of its most obvious sources of imported energy. The other
members of the so called Group of Friends of Venezuela; Brazil, Chile,
Mexico, Portugal and Spain, and its key neighbor and trading partner
Colombia, must understand that the time for a solution is upon us and
this will entail much more that simply observing the process. The
world has to be ready to respond expeditiously to requests for
political and material assistance from a future "transition"
government.

The author is a former Member of the Board of Petróleos de Venezuela
ahlahan
2003-12-09 17:50:04 UTC
Permalink
Excellent article - Thanks !
Post by JFK
Post by ahlahan
"Speaking during his weekly television and radio broadcast "Hello
President", Chavez demanded that he be allowed to personally count the
signatures "one by one".
"
Hmmmm ... that will keep him busy for 6 o 7 years. Is this Chavez the
biggest idiot in Latin America ?
What is this assholes education ?
In the politics of this third world nation one calls it the
"survival-of-the-least-fit"......
Enjoy this article below.
Jonathan -
[EL UNIVERSAL] - Over the last four years, Venezuelan society has been
ravished by a no-holds-barred political crisis. With efforts to recall
President Hugo Chavez entering their critical weeks, Venezuela is
poised to go into a transition fraught with risks and challenges.
Events upon us will define the extent to which the holder of the
largest energy reserves in the Americas can avert civil conflict and
resolve its problems democratically.
Venezuela's problems did not begin yesterday. Prior to today's
polarization, Venezuela had undergone two decades of decline in every
possible quality-of-life measure. Since 1958, and for exactly four
decades, a set of implicit and explicit pacts amongst the nation's
elites brought about what seemed to be political stability. But,
greased with copious income from oil exports, these deals only served
to stifle competition in the economy and enshrined neglect and
impunity in and out of government.
Nowhere is the "survival-of-the-least-fit" incongruity more evident
and destructive than in the political arena. President Hugo Chavez,
elected by a hapless blend of uninspired competition and voter
despondency, has failed to internalize that he is not so much the
redeemer but the embodiment of an immense evolutionary tragedy. If a
"modern" society opts for someone so clearly unhinged, one can only
infer that umpteen billions of dollars were wasted over decades
building what has turned into a Caribbean drenched version of the
village at Potemkin.
The ongoing political crisis represents a radical reversal of fortune
for Hugo Chávez whose popularity has dwindled from 80 to 35 percent
according to most polls. For the opposition movement, as heterogeneous
as the country itself, it seems the President's unraveling came about
too rapidly. Its molten political infrastructure and discredited
leadership have been incapable of morphing its abundant oomph into a
desirable or viable governing alternative. If Chávez still commands
support, it is because you cannot fill a real gap with a virtual void.
To understand Venezuela, you must appreciate that unchecked access to
billions of dollars derived from the state controlled oil industry has
granted Mr. Chávez the "right" to ignore the demands of the majority
that was once his. Other leaders have not enjoyed this luxury and are
forced to either negotiate or leave office when confronted with a
significant and sustained challenge from a dejected population or
parliament.
The key challenge for Venezuela today is not only to survive the
wanton destruction brought about by revolutionary involution, but also
to pull itself out of a fatal tailspin with new leadership that
reestablishes legitimacy and governability. Only thus, can we face the
epic challenge of addressing the disgraceful poverty that has come to
describe and indict our country. This stabilization process is easier
described than executed given the bizarre leadership struggle under
way among those who seek to recall or topple Mr. Chávez.
If the opposition is able to defend the signatures obtained this past
weekend, and then garner enough votes, ninety days hence, to recall
the now unpopular president, they must then field one or more
candidates that are able to offer choices, capture the imagination and
buy much needed time from an impatient electorate. Traditional
politicians and their conspicuous private sector corrupters will have
to listen to a population begging them to quit maneuvering and give
others, probably less experienced, but perhaps more virtuous, a chance
to present their case and lead. Uncontaminated leadership will be
required because putting the Venezuelan Humpty Dumpty back together
will involve drawing on the best to deal with: reconciliation among
its citizens; reconstruction of a gravely defective Judicial system;
re-institutionalization of the fragmented and politicized Armed
Forces; redefinition of production strategy and corporate governance
in the vital oil sector; modernization of the civil service;
decentralization as a means to share responsibility with the states
over the delivery of services and execution of public works; mending
of traditional international relationships and alliances: and eviction
of all foreign armed elements. And, all these tasks after, or
simultaneous, with the promethean task of resuscitating a moribund
economy.
If on the other hand, by hook or by crook, Mr. Chávez is able to fight
off the recall drive at either the petition or voting stage, he too
will have to come up with a way to transition from his current style
of governance to one more democratic and effective. Of course, there
is a risk that Mr. Chávez might assume his unlikely victory as a
mandate to corner and liquidate his opponents. If this were the case,
the transition of power will inexorably occur through more concerted
civil disobedience that has unceremoniously brought down other self
appointed saviors and spent tyrants in the recent past such as Alberto
Fujimori, Slobodan Milosevic, Joseph Estrada and, most recently,
Edward Shevardnadze.
We are on the verge of a complex transition in Venezuela. The
international community must be ready to resolutely ensure that the
threat of violence is defused under all transition scenarios. The
United States has much at stake and cannot afford to err when dealing
with one of its most obvious sources of imported energy. The other
members of the so called Group of Friends of Venezuela; Brazil, Chile,
Mexico, Portugal and Spain, and its key neighbor and trading partner
Colombia, must understand that the time for a solution is upon us and
this will entail much more that simply observing the process. The
world has to be ready to respond expeditiously to requests for
political and material assistance from a future "transition"
government.
The author is a former Member of the Board of Petróleos de Venezuela
AT
2003-12-10 00:46:50 UTC
Permalink
SOON TO BE NAMED

GOOD BY, GOLPISTA !!!!

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